Welcome back! Today we’re looking at a couple of rear-wheel-drive coupes for the same price. Well, actually, I say coupes, but one of them has rear doors, and the other has a retractable hardtop. But apparently you can call anything a coupe these days, so that’s what I’m going with for these two.
Yesterday’s choices were both definitely coupes, not a rear door or a hatchback to be found. And as far as hopped-up economy cars go, they were both pretty cool choices. I’m surprised the Cobalt had such a strong fan section in the comments; I didn’t think those cars were that popular. It was a really close vote, basically a tie, but as of this writing, the Neon is winning by a few votes.
Besides, as you all know, ties around here go to the author, and while I’m intrigued by the idea of the Cobalt SS, I just don’t like that particular one very much. Make it blue or yellow, and closer to stock, and I might have picked it. But I had a Neon coupe that I just loved, even though it was an SOHC engine and an automatic. I couldn’t pass up the chance at a DOHC manual version.
All right. Let’s move the drive wheels to the back, switch the country of manufacture to Japan, and bump up the price just a little, and see what we can find. Five thousand is as high as I like to go for most Showdowns; it seems like a lot, but “cheap” cars aren’t two grand anymore. Then again, fifteen or twenty-year-old cars are a hell of a lot nicer than they used to be, too; I’m constantly surprised by what I can find. I would have thought these would both be more. Let’s see which one is a better value for the price.
2005 Mazda RX-8 – $5,000
Engine/drivetrain: 1.3-liter two-rotor Wankel rotary, six-speed manual, RWD
Location: Hopkins, MN
Odometer reading: 67,000 miles
Operational status: Runs and drives great
Mazda wasn’t the first manufacturer to use rotary engines in its cars, of course, but I bet it will be the last. Rotary engines just don’t work all that well, but they are fascinating, and nothing feels or sounds quite like them. This latest iteration of Mazda rotary-powered sports car, the RX-8, has a terrible reputation for unreliability, so much so that RX-8s are common subjects for engine swaps. But to me, that just isn’t right. I mean, you can make an “apple pie” from Ritz crackers, but it just isn’t the same.
This RX-8 still proudly sports its Renesis rotary engine, its two triangular rotors spinning a six-speed manual gearbox just like it should. It has 67,000 miles on the odometer, which would seem low for most other cars, but for an RX-8, that’s getting up there. It runs great, according to the seller, and has been well-maintained. It has a few minor modifications, namely a short-throw shifter and some thicker sway bars. The stock parts are included if you want to put them back.
It is very clean, inside and out, which isn’t surprising given the low mileage. It’s a Minnesota car, which raises some questions about rust, but the seller says it has been “barely driven” during the winter. Probably a good idea anyway; RWD sports coupes like this aren’t great winter cars.
It looks black in the photos, but the seller says it’s actually a very dark green. Also, note the little triangle shape below the rear bumper; Mazda included triangular shapes all over the RX-8. I’m surprised Mazda never had a tie-in deal with Doritos. It seems like a marketing match made in heaven.
2010 Lexus IS250C – $5,000
Engine/drivetrain: 2.5-liter dual overhead cam V6, six-speed automatic, RWD
Location: Irving, TX
Odometer reading: 218,000 miles
Operational status: Runs and drives great
When it comes to two-door cars built for pleasure, you usually have to choose between a hardtop and a convertible. Some convertibles offer a removable hardtop for the winter months, but then you have to find a place to store it in the summer and figure out a way to get it on and off in the first place. A retractable hardtop that folds into the trunk is a better solution. Peugeot was the first to do it, back in the 1930s, but Ford was the first to mass-produce such a car, in 1957. The idea fell out of fashion for a long time after that, but in the 2000s and 2010s, it seemed like everybody offered a retractable hardtop convertible, including Lexus.
The IS series is Lexus’s entry-level platform, a rear-wheel-drive compact that is typically seen as a four-door sedan. But from 2010-2015, Lexus offered the IS as a two-door convertible coupe, with a couple of different powertrain options. This IS250C is powered by a 2.5 liter DOHC V6 and a six-speed automatic, with flappy-paddle shifters on the steering wheel so you can shift it manually if you so choose. It runs and drives well, though it does have quite a lot of miles on it. It’s for sale by a dealer, so don’t expect any service records, either. You’ll have to rely on an inspection and assume that a bunch of maintenance has been deferred.
It definitely shows some signs of wear inside. It doesn’t look abused; it just looks like a car with over 200,000 miles on it. The seller says the air conditioning works, and the top goes up and down; as long as the stereo works, what more do you need?
It looks pretty good outside, but again, a little worn. The tires look like they need replacing, and I don’t understand why they didn’t wash it before taking the photos. Yeah, it’s a reasonably cheap car, but a run through the carwash is like ten bucks.
So there you have it: a nice clean example of a potential heartbreaker, or a threadbare but probably indestructible luxury convertible coupe. They’re both a lot of car for five grand. The choice is yours.
(Image credits: Craigslist sellers)
The interior of the Lexus is scarier than the Renesis engine in the Mazda.
I saw that one seat photo and voted Mazda.
The triangle under the RX8 rear bumper is the rear fog light in Europe. Until today I thought the shape was just weirdness but I’ve just made the obvious link. Doh.
Years ago, I taught a buddy to drive a manual as he wanted an RX-8. Gave him a couple lessons-then told him to keep my Subaru GL wagon for a week to practice. This was because my clutch cost maybe $200, and the RX’s was an order of magnitude more to get replaced.
In return, I got to use the RX for a weekend. Smooth, way quicker than I was used too, and pretty good in the curves. Downside was the mass, but I was used to flyweight shitboxes. Would love to drive one again.
PS : The RX got burnt when I declined to put underbody glow on it and he got some guy to do it who didn’t bother with fuses. Ouch.
I’ve always liked the RX8 despite the garbage under the hood. The ONLY thing to like about the Lex is the color.
I’ll take the Mazda and hoon it until it blows up. Could be a fun weekend autox car.
I loved the color of the Lexus, but that interior is awful. Definitely going for some rotary action today.
Sadly the Lexus interior looks like every other 200k mile Japanese car. They really need to talk to the Germans about leather quality.
I took a RX-8 for a test drive years ago and loved it. It’d be a 3rd car in the garage so it wouldn’t see a lot of mileage. The interior of the Lexus let it down. The blue paint looks great, but I couldn’t get past the very worn white leather (or pleather?).
no it’s leather. hard to keep white leather looking good at 200km, German or not.
I love the concept of the rotary engine, and I enjoy rowing my own gears, but I will take the vehicle that is not powered by the
tickinghumming time bomb that is the Renesis engine. I’ve driven my share of RX-8s, and not even a twang of nostalgia will drag me into that bad decision. Miata Is Always The Answer, but RX-8 is not.Plus convertible.
RX-8 for me… even with my knowledge that owning one of them will require special care and preemptive maintenance to keep it reliable including being aggressive with the oil changes, feeding it nothing less than 91 octane fuel and also running it to the redline at least once every time I drive it to avoid carbon buildup and to help keep the Apex Seals healthy. .
I wouldn’t daily drive it. But as a weekend car and future classic that might appreciate in value? Definitely.
And I’ve driven these before. Not the fastest cars, but they are definitely very nice to drive and a unique driving experience.
As a former Minnesotan, I’d normally never buy a car from there. With that said, as a former Texan, that Lexus is in rough shape which almost always means it is in worse shape than it seems. Assuming the ad is accurate, Mazda it is.
The Lexis is thrashed and hardtop convertibles are a major pain in the ass for everyday use unless you leave the roof up all the time (which defeats the purpose)
Is there really concern about the Mazda engine when it’s well maintained? Seems to me that’s the correct choice today.
While my usual requirement for considering any rotary car hinges on the words, “freshly rebuilt engine”, the RX-8 is priced well enough enough that it might be worth a gamble after some negotiating. I had a brief affair with an 83 RX-7 with the 12A, and I gotta say that I’d love to feel a modern rotary. Even if it’ll only last for a year or two.
I didn’t even bother reading the Lexus writeup. That thing could come with a babe in the passenger seat and Bruce Springsteen sitting in the back, playing me driving songs, and I still wouldn’t take it over a gorgeous, well-running RX. I’d trade a kidney for the final RX-7, but this 8 will do for $5k, and it’s not like I’m going to put enough miles on it to run into the big maintenance costs (fingers crossed).
I like the RX8, and I was thinking “how do you put 200k miles on a Lexus convertible?” But I’ll bet the owner lives in Irving and commutes to Austin/Houston regularly. Big state would rack up a lot of miles. The interior is worn, but the white probably shows it worse that it is. I wouldn’t buy it, but for $5k it’s a better deal than the Mazda. That car needs a maintenance discount.
When I went to Skip Barber’s driving school back in the day, they used RX-8s to teach skid recovery. At the end of our class, the instructor turned to us and said “well, we’re done a little early … do y’all want to learn how to power-slide?”
That was the moment I fell in love with the RX-8.
I know it’d probably break my heart the second I got it back to Chicago, but I’ll still take the Mazda.
Oof, I was leaning towards the Lexus until seeing that interior. Yikes. But that blue hue is soooooo, tempting! While I’d prefer a third peddle, I could live with the floppy paddles in this. But despite Lexus’ reputation for lasting forever, at 200k+ miles, it is going to need things replaced, and coming from a dealer, there is going to be no clue which things those are until you’re out and about with it.
So I went with the Mazda. Yeah, the RX8 needs apex seals. And will need them frequently. And will drink oil like Homer drinks Duff. Okay, now I’m second guessing my choice.
I went with the RX-8 because, in a pinch, you can MacGyver the rotors into throwing stars for those unexpected ninja attacks.
The Lexus wins by default. Toyota makes the best cars, and it’s definitely better than a shitty rotary engine, and the IS-C is a cooler color combo.
The Mazda is one of the few cars where 100k is still considered high-mileage 🙁
Too bad they didn’t keep making RX-8s AFTER they bought themselves back from Ford. After that, Mazdas actually became reliable.
yeah, but not the wankel 😛
I don’t recall them ever reattempting the Wankel since. (upcoming wankel not included)
Wankel engines cannot be made reliable or clean. Apex seals need to be replaced regularly, no matter how well you care for them, and the design allows for more oil blow-by than a piston engine, leading to more pollutants in the exhaust.
The Wankel, while fun and cool, is a dead-end design.
This was genuinely a tough choice since both have pluses and minuses, but I think I’d take the Mazda. That Lexus just looks too ragged out and if that top fails, good luck.
Plus how can you say no to a manual?
I cannot believe that the RX Grenade v8 is getting so many votes. I mean we are literally at the mileage for apex seal failure. I would gamble that the Lexus at 3.5x more mileage will drive farther and longer than that RX-Oil Burning Edition 8.
So two vehicles that have ~2.5liter engines :p.
Car nerds know of the contention around rotary displacement…. Righhht?
I’d rock the Lexus. I dunno why you guys are so afraid of worn leather and some dirt. Get a Handheld Vacuum some windex and start going ham. It would look a lot better in no time. Trust me, it made my 600$ civics interior look so much better.
Compression test the RX-8 and use that as a negotiating tool. With that kind of mileage, you could likely reuse the housings if it needed a rebuild and start fresh with a known engine. Premix a little in the tank and keep it from overheating and you are good to go. Rotaries have a reputation, much of it deserved, but the problem is they aren’t a mass market engine. An enthusiast who can take some extra steps is going to get way more miles out of a rotary than the general population who likes to ignore things.
A Grand Canyon-sized gap in reliability here. Even with 200k, it’s a Toyota and will continue to rack up miles without complaint.
And RX-8 needs work five minutes after it leaves the shop. No thanks.
If a car interior could have the clap, that Lexus would be what it looks like.
I’ll take my chances on the Mazda.