It’s been a rough few years for customers of the various Stellantis brands, and I’m not certain that’s going to improve in the foreseeable future. It’s also been a tough time for dealers and workers, who can expect its absurdly high “days on lot” figures to drop as Stellantis execs cut production and unfortunately lay off workers.
The big talk of the day is how Stellantis is cutting back, but this was inevitable to some degree as the company tries to fix its inventory issues. For workers, it’s bad news. For weary consumers, this might be a bit of good news as we could be reaching a key point in time where incentives and inventory are simultaneously high. Eventually, one of those has to give.
And, eventually, Stellantis CEO Carlos Tavares has to go. It wouldn’t be a Morning Dump if at least one of our stories didn’t have our favorite exec show up, right? The plan was to let Tavares run out his contract and depart in early 2026. Rumor has it that Tavares might be getting pushed out of the plane before it lands (metaphorically speaking), but at least it’ll come with the mother of all golden parachutes.
The grass is always greener on the other side, they say, but in the case of Stellantis v. Volkswagen that might be a little hopeful. Perhaps it’s better to say that the grass is a little less on fire on the other side. VW’s Q3 financials are bad. Real bad. Revenue wasn’t a complete miss but margins were in the toilet.
Sometimes low expectations are helpful. Sometimes it’s nice for the bar to be on the ground. Aston Martin also released its financials, and they’re better than people thought, which is to say they lost less money than analysts predicted.
Take The Money And Run
It’s time again for my favorite chart, via Cox Automotive/vAuto, which shows how many days worth of cars different dealers have on the lot. A healthy number is 60 days, the average is 68 days, and earlier this year every Stellantis brand was way, way above average. Ram has been so bad that Ram isn’t even on the chart.
There are two main variables that give you the number of selling days: supply and demand. If you’ve got a ton of cars but they’re selling super fast then it’ll stay low. For the last year, Stellantis has seemed intent on making these worse for its Chrysler, Dodge, Jeep, and Ram dealers by both building a ton of uncompetitive cars and then refusing to give reasonable discounts on them even as much of the competition started dumping cash on the hood.
Dealers flipped out and now Stellantis is trying to address both problems simultaneously. First, Stellantis told its dealers it’ll provide more money to help move cars and, indeed, the company reportedly just added a bunch of cash for “conquest” buyers who want certain Dodge, Jeep, or Ram products. Specifically, Stellantis is targeting Ford buyers who come over to get a Durango, Wrangler, Grand Wagoneer/Wagoneer, Grand Cherokee, or Ram 1500 with an extra $2,000.
Incentives are always good for buyers, and they’d last forever if Stellantis kept pumping out vehicles. Understandably, that’s not going to happen according to The Detroit News:
Stellantis NV continued to slash vehicle production and cut jobs in the United States this week, including at the automaker’s Detroit Assembly Complex where the Jeep Grand Cherokee and Dodge Durango SUVs are built.
Vehicle production at both the Mack and Jefferson sides of the east-side complex is paused this week, with workers temporarily laid off. Notices sent to workers said certain positions were still expected to report. Mack builds the Grand Cherokee, while Jefferson makes both the Grand Cherokee and Durango.
“Stellantis continues to take the necessary actions to align production with sales,” said a company statement sent by spokesperson Ann Marie Fortunate. “This includes making production adjustments at both Detroit Assembly Complex plants. The Company will continue to monitor the situation to assess whether further action is required.”
This follows other recent cutbacks. Hell, Chrysler only makes the Pacifica now, having ended 300 production. Obviously, this is a shame for workers at these facilities, even if the recent UAW contract helps preserve some of their income.
If you’re a consumer and you’ve been turned off by high prices and you’re interested in something from one of the traditional Chrysler brands then now might be the best time to act. Incentives are high as Stellantis wants to calm down dealers and the company is also rightsizing production, so there may be fewer cars on dealer lots eventually (these changes will take weeks to filter through the system).
Is Carlos Tavares Getting An Early Exit?
Stellantis CEO Carlos Tavares, pictured above, managed to survive a recent executive shakeup, albeit with the stated intention that he’d have to retire in a little over a year. This after rumors that Stellantis NV Chairman John Elkann was already looking for a replacement. Tavares was supposed to make it until 2026, but rumor has it that he might finally get to finish Finnegans Wake next year as he’ll be granted an early release from the company.
This rumor comes from the Italian news site Affaritaliani.it and it’s a whopper:
That Carlos Tavares is ready to hang up his CEO boots and leave the reins of Stellantis in 2026 is now known to everyone. The aim is to choose the new leader already in the first half of 2025, to ensure a smooth handover, whether it is internal or external. Yet voices very close to the world of the old Fiat tell Affaritaliani.it that Tavares could leave by the end of the year, with a mind-blowing severance package (the figure could even reach 100 million euros). And not only that. An “extra” severance package with shares or a stake in a premium brand of the group is also reportedly being evaluated. In short, a noteworthy exit strategy and in line with the salary that the Portuguese manager has pocketed up to now (23.5 million in 2023, ed.)
But it doesn’t end there. There are also rumors that the owner , John Elkann, is pushing to have Carlos Tavares leave Stellantis earlier than expected, on the advice of his lawyers, in light of a possible trial related to money laundering, offshore accounts and tax evasion in which the brothers Lapo and Ginevra would also be involved, after the investigation opened by their mother, Margherita Agnelli. A significant shake-up that could tamper not only with the leadership of the group, but also with the “delicate” family safe, Dicembre.
Sure. Honestly, if I were Tavares I’d love this rumor. What’s better than not having to be CEO of Stellantis anymore? Getting paid $100 million to not do the job (the Euro and USD are close enough). I’ve also heard a rumor that I’m being demoted to Assistant Publisher and being given $100 million as a bonus.
Who would replace Tavares? People seem to think Renault’s Luca De Meo.
Volkswagen Is, Eh, It’s Not Great
Not that I want to focus on bad news, but I’ve already said this week that it looked like Volkswagen might try something drastic to reverse its plunge, and it seems like this quarter’s financials might be decent pretext.
Revenues hit $85 billion, which is up a little from last year, but operating profit fell 42% compared to Q3 2023 to just $3.1 billion, which is an operating margin of 3.6%. That’s real bad and worse than expected. The chart above shows what the first nine months look like for the company and it’s dire.
From VW’s CFO Arno Antlitz:
Our nine-month results reflect a challenging market environment and underline the importance of delivering on the performance programmes we have launched across the Group. Volkswagen Brand reported an operating margin of only two per cent after nine months. This highlights the urgent need for significant cost reductions and efficiency gains.
Our product momentum gives us confidence. A significantly improved order intake in Western Europe in Q3 year-on-year is testament to our strengthened product line-up, from combustion engine cars to hybrids and full-electric vehicles.
Excuse me, from what-to-what? Oh, right, VW is finally doing hybrids.
This is a bad look, and the only two groups making any sort of decent margin are the Sport Luxury brand group (Porsche, Lamborghini, Porsche Financial Services) and its TRATON Commercial Vehicles group. There is the Rivian investment to consider. Also, if you want to get conspiratorial, it would probably be better at this point for Volkswagen to make its numbers as terrible as possible if only as an excuse to take drastic action.
Aston Martin Is Not Doing As Poorly As You’d Have Guessed
If you’re a Fernando Alonso fan you might have some mixed feelings about Aston Martin. The same might be true if you’re an investor. Don’t worry! Alonso is retiring and things might not be as bad as they once seemed for people with a financial stake in the company.
After hinting at a rough year due to sales in China and supply chain disruptions, the company released its Q3 numbers and, though not exactly rosy, they aren’t grim either. The company only lost about $16 million pre-tax in Q3, an improvement of 90% over last year.
This is better than expected and the company belives things might turn around a bit:
Following the successful launch of the new Vantage and DBX707, with deliveries commencing as planned at the end of Q2 2024, performance in Q4 2024 will benefit from all next generation core models available in market including initial deliveries of the V12 flagship Vanquish. In addition, Valiant, the ultraexclusive Special, remains on track with the majority of deliveries expected by year end, concluding the current programme of Specials.
Good for them.
What I’m Listening To While Writing TMD
Oh man. When Scottish band Garbage came out I was both a little scared and, because I was a 12-year-old boy, very excited when the video for “I’m Only Happy When It Rains” came on MTV so I could see Shirley Manson glower at me from a partially demo’d bathroom. Rewatching this video again I still get it.
The Big Question
What would Shirley Manson drive in 1995, when the self-titled Garbage album debuted? What would YOU drive if you had to buy a new car in 1995?
Shirley Manson is always exciting!
Also, a Neon for Shirley, Ferrari F-50 for me.
She was a great Terminator.
She’s Scottish and wants misery poured down on her.
Clearly she’d drive a Jaguar XJS V12.
From 1995?
Z31 TT Manual….
Damn, to the classifieds I go…..
I’ve been waiting for the Canadian November incentives to drop to see if I can make a RAM 1500 make sense. Fingers crossed they can make it cheap enough to entertain a test drive.
While I can make a mid-size work, a full size is better suited to the interior dimensions I desire.
In 1995 I had a five-year-old Protege LX with the 130-hp 1.8L and a five speed that I really enjoyed. That said, I’d probably have taken a Lexus SC300 so I could get the manual instead of the mandatory automatic with the V8 if the allotted budget would handle it, or maybe a BMW convertible. Nice, but not too flashy or impractical for the times.
If I was a high school girl it’d be a 240SX in white. If I was (and am) me, an Allante.
Look…I know this is crazy, but I have a wild ass idea that will net save Stellantis €50M.
Hold on to your asses for this one – Don’t pay a fucking dime in executive severance. Boom, savings.
I’ll take the standard 50% fee for consultant found efficiencies, I’ll await contact from the Stellantis corporate board.
This world is so fucked up, the guy gets 25m a year to “work”, yet they are ok to give him 4times that to stop working a year earlier…
It’s sickening.
But,but, these companies HAVE to offer a competitive executive compensation package or else NO ONE will want to work for them.
Their executive compensation advisory board, made up of executives from other companies, thinks executive compensation is worth every penny.
Wow, you’re telling me that by fucking over the known pool of exectives, some utter pleb, who’s never been an executive before will somehow manage to do the job for 0.25x the pay and we might accidently get some competence instead of feeding the insider yatch club circle jerk?
Maybe we could get something by having a higher tax bracket over $1M annual compensation (of any kind).
In the glory days of the American middle class, the top marginal tax rates were well over 90%. Albeit with every damned thing under the sun being tax deductible, but still, the wealthy paid a HELL of a lot more in taxes than they do today, and getting “paid” in stock was not really a thing.
Somehow the people who get most concerned about the deficit (well, when a Democrat is in office) never suggest returning to this model.
Funny how that works. Sigh.
IIRC, the effective rate was still typically around 70% after write offs. And look at what we were able to accomplish as a nation at that time.
Encouraged companies to take their business to more tax- friendly countries?
Sent people to the moon, built and maintained a massive military that included stuff like the SR-71, developed tech that became the modern world, nuclear power plants, built thousands of schools, had a more egalitarian society, and so on. Offshoring didn’t really take off until after they started whittling away the taxes the rich had to pay and they used those savings to buy politicians to whittle away taxes further, do nothing about offshoring, and basically convince the working class that getting pissed on was rain in a drought until here we are today with half the country willing to burn it all down.
Ah, Garbage. From that bygone era when you could name a band after an everyday word without having to ccok up the spelling to make it searchable.
4th Gen Prelude with VTEC, 4WS, and a manual transmission.
Garbage is not a Scottish band. It was formed by three American guys at the University of Wisconsin. When they were looking to grow their music they hit upon the idea of a female lead singer in the mold of Patti Smith or Chrissie Hynde. Shirley Manson fit the bill perfectly, so they contacted her agent and traveled to see her in Edinburgh and London. Initially she was resistant to joining the group because she was more performance (gig) oriented while they were largely studio based. Eventually, they won her over and the result was Garbage their 1995 debut hit album.
Anyway, I think if Shirley drove anything in 1995, it was probably a Ford Escort. I, however, would have selected a Mazda RX-7.
I agree. Specifically a mid-80s Escort with torn upholstery.
Interesting history of Garbage. I didn’t know of the UW connection.
Shirley Manson’s character would drive a 1995 Viper. Shirley Manson in real life would drive a 1995 Ford Contour. Or maybe a Taurus wagon. You know, something sensible to haul around art supplies and band equipment.
think about the decisions in your life that brought you here.
We have been forced into doing our part. After small print got her 500X totaled for her, we leased a new Escape that came optioned with a ton of cash on the hood.
I just can’t wrap my head around rewarding one of the worst performing car company CEOs in this century with a $100M golden parachute.
I don’t think he’s in a bargaining position to demand that much, which makes me question the executive board even more than Tavares.
Now the Big Question: I’d have settled with an Acura Integra GSR or a Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX back in 1995.
Maybe Stellantis will get cheaper by coming out with vehicles without overinflated MSRPs!
(lol)
I suggest they toss Carlos off the plane and create a Sergio Marchionne AI to run the company. I doubt it could do any worse than ending production of existing models while having absolutely nothing to replace them for over a year. The janitor could have come up with a better plan.
I was surprised to note Ferrari has 97 days of inventory. I assumed that making you buy something you don’t want to buy something you do want could be a good way to control excess inventory.
The Big Question: I actually bought a vehicle in 1995, a Nissan value package truck; regular cab, 4×2, 5spd. It served me well for 14 years before I sold it on. If money had been no object, I’m pretty sure I would have bought a 1995 Mazda MX-6, but I couldn’t swing the payments and insurance. For the record, I was living in Atlanta in 1995 and my monthly insurance on the truck was $185 and my payment was $172. It cost me more to insure the truck than the monthly payments. Also, let that $172 monthly payment sink in versus that cost to finance for 60 months today.
Marchionne started this huge mess, we shall remember, he was no better.
Was looking to see if someone else would comment on Ferrari being in there. I always read how they have multi-year waiting lists, so I don’t get that. Do they set aside a certain percentage of production to stock dealers? Is that where all those Rosso Prevedibile ones come from?
I seem to recall an interview in which Shirley admitted that she didn’t have a driver’s license, so I’m guessing she was shuttled around in limos and taxis. So she would have been riding in Lincoln Town Cars, Cadillac DeVilles (or were they DTS’s by ’95?), London Taxis, Crown Vics, Mercedes (Benz, not Streeter).
What would I buy in 1995? Money no object, Bugatti EB 110. Money somewhat of an object? Toyota Supra Turbo.
If only there was a single Stellantis product that interested me.
A 7yr bumper to bumper and a 10yr/unlimited mileage powertrain would probably move a whole lot of Pacificas quickly with minor discounts. But I’d wager those are already not the ones piling up. Anything else is pretty meh. A bet a Grand Cherokee would be a really nice daily with $8k on the hood and a plan to get rid of it the day before the warranty expires.
They’ll be cheaper when the brands are discontinued
As they should be! What a superfluous group of brands.
Still 8 Chrysler 300s for sale at the dealer site I just checked out. At some point they may have to get crazy and make them cheaper.
The only way Stellantis can move units is doing 199/299/399 leases with zero down, no credit check.
Bring back the Lifetime Warranty. Owners loved them
If only you could rely on dealer warranty service. Sounds like they’d 1) potentially tell you they don’t want your warranty work. Or 2) your car would sit there for 2 months while they wait for guidance or a part from corporate.
Maybe if you are lucky, you can snag a Hornet or Compass loaner?! Thanks for buying the Grand Wagoneer!
As a former Ram 1500 owner I recall the fellow forum members who purchased one with the Lifetime warranty and most of them had good experiences.
Even some other CDJR forum members would recall not getting rid of their 250K mile Caliber or Nitro because the warranty was so good. Not sure I’d be able to keep up with those penalty boxes despite the warranty, though.
Of course the small dotted line would say the dealer could refuse warranty work and pay you blue book value if the warranty work exceeded the vehicle’s value. But that was still better than most warranties. I understand why FCA discontinued it back in the late 2010s (and why it doesn’t make any financial sense today)
My mind will always first associate Garbage with Gran Turismo, moreso “I Think I’m Paranoid” and GT2 since I played that one more.
I’d probably be shopping sporty coupes/hatches in 1995. Multiple Honda options, Probe/MX-6, DSMs, plenty more options…
Same here… was trying to remember if it was GT or Ridge Racer.
This. Admittedly I’m not a huge gamer now but the GT2 sound track still stands out.
Only matter of time before Jon Lovitz sends a cease and desist to the Autopian. Why would he do that? He clearly has no sense of humor and doesn’t know what is funny. /s
His manager is busy trying to figure out why Jon’s Q score spikes every time Stellantis makes news.
I wish I could be a miserable piece of shit who sucks at my job and get paid 100 million to quit. Shit, I’d be happy with 3-5 million. That would be enough for me to fuck off for the rest of my life and do nothing but travel and enjoy my hobbies. Anyway, maybe we should do something about the systems in place that allow this type of nonsense to happen? Just a thought.
Anyway I’ll occasionally browse Charger listings to see if they’re finally being blown out (especially considering my rash of issues with the Kona N) and at least in my area they’re still hilariously expensive. Gotta love that Stellantis is just now realizing that the “charge more for worse products and tell everyone to eat a bag of dicks” approach isn’t sustainable. Go figure.
What kind of issues have you had with your N? I’ve been scared of Hyundai/Kia drivetrains, so I’m curious how the engine has treated you.
It was great through 15,000 miles and plenty of spirited driving. Unfortunately it went into limp mode while I was driving about a month ago and the check engine light came on/it wouldn’t rev over 2,000. It was apparently due to a recall, which they fixed but took their sweet time with.
It then did it again about a week later and just spent about 10 days at the dealership. It keeps throwing a knock sensor code, so they replace the knock sensors this round. If this doesn’t fix it, it will need an entire engine replacement. At 15,500 miles no less.
I’m not touching Hyundai or Kia again personally. A 2.5 year old car having issues of this caliber is completely unacceptable.
Oof, at least my perma-broken truck (yes, it’s got another CEL) has the excuse of being 10 years old.
Last night I was behind a Nissan and next to a Ram. Made me wonder which company is having a harder time of it. Seems Nissan has far less resources, but they do have a better legacy in which to pull.
Maybe it depends on where you live or who you associate with, but at least around me this is crazy to say. I’m not sure I’ve ever met a loyal multi-time Nissan buyer in my life, while the number of guys who buy Jeeps or Ram trucks over and over is off the charts.
I bought a nissan once. Really liked it up to 100k and 5 years old. Then it seemed to age 20 years and 200k in the next year. Just kept shedding parts. couldn’t be rid of it fast enough
Yep, I definitely know a lot of one-time Nissan buyers.
Even going off a vague concept of “legacy”, I think Mopar has a lot more iconic vehicles in their past than Nissan does, but it’s possible I’m biased there.
Maybe Angel meant Stellantis v. Nissan, rather than brand-specific? Because I agree with you– Jeep and Ram loyalty is real. But approximately 0% of Americans are excited about “Stellantis.”
I was more referencing cars we liked as kids and if they show up in some sort of retro model, like the new Silva. I certainly wasn’t saying Nissan repeat buyers. Are there 2 brands with worse customer retention then Chrysler/Stellantis and Nissan? Maybe Range Rover, maybe.
Looks like based on Consumer Reports data, VW belongs in that group too.
https://www.visualcapitalist.com/charted-car-brand-loyalty-in-2024/
I used to know a few loyal Nissan buyers, but that was several decades ago, when they still made decent cars.
As we have at least a 50/50 chance of substantial and broad tariffs being imposed next year, has anybody done an analysis of what that would do to the car industry? Even cars made in the USA use significant amounts foreign-made components that would conceivably get a lot more expensive.
People have done this analysis and the conclusion seems to be: it would be real real bad.
Yeah, that stands to reason.
That applies to the outcome of nearly any concept exiting the Orange Menace’s mouth.
I think its more than 50-50, Harris and Trump have similar rhetoric in terms of China and in regard to imported EVs, and Biden has already been pretty tough with tariffs, expect either one will only tighten things further
Trump’s tariffs would be everything, though. One can expect Harris to continue Biden’s very friendly interpretation of the IRA to foreign EVs.
You consider a 100% tariff on Chinese EVs to be a friendly interpretation?
Friendly to every significant company selling cars in the USA today except Geely, yes.
Not to GM, who is also getting hit with 100% on any Buicks they might want to bring in from Shanghai
When I said “friendly interpretation of the IRA” I was specifically referring to the lease loophole for the $7500 credit, which allow discounted leases on EVs that don’t meet the purchase tax credit requirement. This is a matter of interpretation of the IRA and it’s highly likely a Trump administration would stop interpreting the IRA this way.
I don’t necessarily agree with the 100% tariff on Chinese cars but it really has nothing to do with my comment you responded to.
Yeah, but the original comment at the top was about chances for new/enhanced tarrifs next year, which I would say are about the same regardless of who wins. Tax credits on EVs are a different matter entirely
I don’t think we need to tell GM explicitly that they should be building the Buicks here in the US if they want to sell them here.
Elon said yesterday that his and Trump’s plan for the economy would cause “temporary pain”. Yes, temporary pain for US, and long-term gain for THEM.
I’m reading “And Then the Wolf Came”, a history of the collapse of the US steel industry. It is interesting how spikes in unemployment (up to nearly 11% in 1982!) were useful to get workers back “under control” of the CEO class.
What would I drive if I could purchase a new car in 1995? The BMW 850CSi in Technoviolet
The only option for the stylish cocaine aficionado.
We could race, because I would have a 288 GTO
…or maybe an RS200, or any one of the other Group B homologation specials.
None of those were new in 1995
Allow me to retort;
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ferrari_288_GTO#:~:text=The%20Ferrari%20GTO%20(often%20referred,Omologata%20(homologated%20in%20Italian).
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_RS200
Shit. 95. I’m old I was thinking 85. FML.
Happens